Redefining Education: How Leadways School is Pioneering Personalized Learning
Adding innovative classes alone isn't enough; we need a fundamental change in education to truly prepare students for the future. In this engaging conversation, Joseph Stark and educational pioneer Jun Liu discuss the transformative power of mixing age groups in learning environments, which fosters empathy and responsibility among students. They delve into how artificial intelligence will reshape education, emphasizing that human skills like communication and empathy will become increasingly vital. As they explore the challenges of traditional education systems, they highlight the importance of real-world experiences in developing problem-finding abilities alongside problem-solving skills. This episode marks the beginning of an exciting journey to reimagine what school can be, paving the way for a new approach to learning that meets the needs of today's students.
Takeaways:
- Merely adding innovative classes won't suffice; we need a fundamental overhaul of education.
- Mixing age groups fosters powerful learning opportunities, enhancing social skills and empathy.
- AI will transform education, making human skills like empathy more critical than ever.
- A student's ability to observe and identify problems is crucial for their growth.
- Real-world experiences provide students with authentic learning that textbooks cannot replicate.
- Personalized learning allows students to progress at their own pace, breaking traditional barriers.
Joseph Stark and Jun Liu explore the pressing need for educational reform in a rich discussion that underscores the limitations of traditional schooling. Jun's journey in education reveals a critical insight: many students enter high school unprepared for the rigors of college, lacking essential skills, passions, and mindsets. This realization inspired her to establish Leadway School, which emphasizes early intervention and personalized learning. By addressing students' needs before they reach high school, Leadway aims to cultivate well-rounded individuals ready to face future challenges. This proactive approach highlights the importance of not just academic achievement but also character development in education.
The conversation deepens as they discuss the innovative practice of mixing age groups within classrooms. Jun argues that this method not only facilitates a nurturing environment where older students mentor younger ones but also cultivates a sense of community and responsibility. Younger students benefit from exposure to diverse perspectives, while older students develop leadership skills and empathy. This dynamic contributes to a more collaborative spirit in learning, contrasting sharply with the rigid, age-segregated model of traditional education. By breaking down barriers and fostering meaningful connections among students of different ages, Leadway School aims to create an enriching educational experience that mirrors real-life interactions.
As they delve into the role of artificial intelligence in education, both Joseph and Jun highlight the need for students to develop human skills—critical thinking, emotional intelligence, and effective communication—as AI becomes more integrated into learning environments. The discussion emphasizes that while technology can enhance personalized learning, it is these 'human skills' that will enable students to navigate complex social landscapes and thrive in a future where AI is prevalent. The episode concludes with a compelling call to action for educators and parents to embrace transformative changes in education, ensuring that the next generation is equipped with the skills necessary for success in an increasingly digital world.
Books Mentioned: The Innovator’s DNA,
Authors mentioned: Jeff Dyer
Transcript
Welcome to the Learning Frontier, where we're redesigning education for today's learners in tomorrow's world.
Joseph Stark:I'm Joseph Stark, your host and founding principal of Leadways School.
Joseph Stark:And today we're venturing into exciting territory with an educational pioneer who's transforming how we think about personalized learning.
Joseph Stark:Our guest today is Jun Liu, founder of Leadway School, my partner in innovation, and a distinguished Wharton alumna whose vision for education goes far beyond traditional boundaries.
Joseph Stark:With over two decades of experience in K12 education, counseling, and college planning, June has helped countless students not just reach but exceed their fullest potential, achieving a remarkable 95% admissions rate into the nation's top 30 universities.
Joseph Stark:But what makes her story particularly fascinating is how she's taking these insights and reimagining what a truly innovative school can be.
Joseph Stark:June, welcome to the show.
Jun Liu:Hi.
Joseph Stark:I love the enthusiasm.
Joseph Stark:So, June, I think it's important for our listeners and, you know, future Leadways family members to know why you wanted to start Leadways School.
Jun Liu:Okay.
Jun Liu:Like what you said.
Jun Liu:I have been working with high school students for the past decades and I realized that many of the high schoolers, when it's time to start a college prep, their lack of some sort of things, either character, personalities, ideas, passions, or even the mindset.
Jun Liu:So every time we have been, you know, try to fix all the issues and problems.
Jun Liu:So then start thinking, is there any way that I can start early?
Jun Liu:So actually our counseling program is getting younger and younger students and the youngest one, actually it was kindergarten.
Jun Liu:Then I start wondering if I can, you know, really influence them with two meetings per month, three meetings per month.
Jun Liu:Is there any way that I can, you know, maybe have a bigger influence if I can involve with them every single day?
Jun Liu:That is actually the original idea.
Jun Liu:But, you know, starting school is always a very far away dream for me.
Jun Liu:So I was you know, actually not really thinking about a start right now.
Jun Liu:I was thinking about maybe when I getting older, you know, but how old are going to be ready?
Jun Liu:And one day I realized that maybe it would never be ready.
Jun Liu:Maybe today is the best today.
Jun Liu:So I just start right away.
Joseph Stark:Do we ever truly feel ready?
Joseph Stark:It's one of those things where I feel like if we're always waiting to feel ready, that we're never going to start anything.
Joseph Stark:And so that is the true risk taking and entrepreneur mindset that we're looking for in some of our kids, you know, and I think our listeners would appreciate for you to share your experience on, you know, what you've noticed are the main reasons of why parents are seeking outside counseling for their kids.
Jun Liu:Okay.
Jun Liu:If I want to compare the school as a farm or forest, Parents need a map.
Jun Liu:They need to help them to find the path and to get to the other side of the world.
Jun Liu:However, there's no map provided.
Jun Liu:No matter whatever school you are in, the kids will be the person navigate themselves, try to find out the map.
Jun Liu:Well, some of the smart kids, I would say maybe 10, 20% they couldn't figure out.
Jun Liu:But many of them, they get lost when they try to navigate the direction.
Jun Liu:So that's why I realized that no matter whatever the school you are in, once you're there, you need a map.
Jun Liu:So that is what actually what a counseling is about.
Jun Liu:But with the younger and younger age students.
Jun Liu:And then I feel like, you know, because the kids is really, it's not really easy to, you know, build a conversation like weekly or monthly because they're too young.
Jun Liu:So most likely we have to really talk to parents.
Jun Liu:And that's how we add on the parents counseling is, you know, more and more so for the past almost 11 years, so we have been doing this over and over again.
Jun Liu:So I kind of feel like it's, you know, it's a, it's a naturally come to today that, you know, is ready to get a school.
Joseph Stark:So what do you think is the most important skill that you know, we would want a student to develop to be ready for the future?
Jun Liu:I feel like you mean the students in now or.
Jun Liu:I feel like the mindset is definitely the first one because I feel like I need to spend a lot of effort, convince them to do something or try something and then actually once they are okay to do it, they can do it perfectly.
Jun Liu:But wanting to do something or make them want something they don't want is really hard and challenging.
Joseph Stark:Yeah, you know, we, we want them to love learning.
Joseph Stark:I mean, that's, that's kind of what hooked me onto Leadway school.
Joseph Stark:When we first met.
Joseph Stark:It was, you know, you kind of explaining, you know, there's, there's all of these students that I'm seeing in my counseling group and they're all lacking these skills.
Joseph Stark:And why, why don't the schools just do that?
Joseph Stark:Right?
Joseph Stark:Why aren't they teaching them these things?
Joseph Stark:And you know, we can, we can definitely do better.
Jun Liu:And so don't you think that's a western and eastern different education concept?
Jun Liu:Because I mean, when I grow up in the, in Mongolia, so our culture is more about like, hey, you know, no matter how smart or how unsmart you are, we will not let you go behind.
Jun Liu:We will always take care of everybody.
Jun Liu:Try to push the potential out.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:And just maximize the potential.
Jun Liu:Be the best of you.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:But I feel like here, this.
Jun Liu:First, I feel that teacher is not like really that strict that when I grow up.
Jun Liu:And second, I feel like it's maybe they believe more about the naturally, you know, survival thing is like, if you can survive in the jungle, you survive, you're strongest.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:So it's more like naturally, you know, let them to, like, wash out or let some of them stand out.
Jun Liu:But, um, for some reason they just.
Jun Liu:I feel like many of the schools here, they really against having extra help to help the kids to grow.
Jun Liu:They more let the kids to.
Jun Liu:I mean, what the.
Jun Liu:The words I heard most is like, that the kids be kids.
Jun Liu:What does that mean?
Jun Liu:I mean, there's so many way to interpret it.
Jun Liu:Let the kids be kids.
Jun Liu:Right?
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Jun Liu:So don't find any outside help.
Jun Liu:Don't find a tutor, don't find a counselor.
Jun Liu:You know, just enjoy.
Jun Liu:And then later on, you know, if you look at the college application side, they select the students.
Jun Liu:They're not like, just, you know, whoever, you know, just get in open to everybody.
Jun Liu:So it's very interesting to have this type of k to 12, naturally enjoy, not too much pressure, and then eventually select.
Jun Liu:Yeah, that's something I'm.
Jun Liu:I'm interesting to discuss with you.
Joseph Stark:Yeah, what.
Joseph Stark:What I think is really interesting about that is that the system isn't made correctly.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Joseph Stark:I mean, we.
Joseph Stark:We try to remove all of these pressures from the students, and we are giving them these skills.
Joseph Stark:And then at the very end, we're like, oh, but it's super competitive, and we hope you're ready to deal with that failure.
Joseph Stark:But, you know, our system's set up to shove kids in a classroom and move them forward year by year, because that's how they've told everybody how they learn.
Joseph Stark:When you're five, you're in kindergarten.
Joseph Stark:When you're in six, you're in first grade.
Joseph Stark:And then you move on through these steps.
Joseph Stark:But no one really cares whether or not you're actually learning.
Joseph Stark:I mean, at least in California, they're gonna shove you almost all the way through high school without even being able to read.
Joseph Stark:It's near impossible to fail a student for real.
Joseph Stark:So I think that learning the correct skills and how to interact with each other is going to be the most important thing that we teach all of our students.
Joseph Stark:You know, and then I just wonder if it's just about resources.
Joseph Stark:But Whatever it is, there's definitely better ways to go about it.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Jun Liu:I think resources is one thing, and the other thing is like they, they let them naturally grow, however, they create a gap.
Jun Liu:So if you look at elementary to middle school, middle school to high school, extremely middle school to high school, there's like a huge knowledge gap.
Jun Liu:Many of the straight A students in middle school, they find a struggle in high school, and in high school, they do provide you the fast track, slow track.
Jun Liu:But if you're on a slow track, you'll never be able to learn enough knowledges, be able to get into the major, the college that you want to.
Jun Liu:Yeah, it just, it's just very, it's very interesting.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Joseph Stark:Yeah.
Joseph Stark:I think it leads into the mindset piece that we were talking about.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Joseph Stark:Where if we can get them to enjoy the struggle a little bit and love the learning process and then be okay with failing that, when they start hitting that wall in high school, they're gonna overcome it.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Jun Liu:So when I look back my history of the successful cases in the counseling program, I can tell many of the kids they are not the most outstanding one or the most competitive one.
Jun Liu:However, you know, with time, with support, with resources, they eventually, you know, get a much better result.
Jun Liu:And those who are very competitive at the beginning, so you can tell the differences.
Joseph Stark:June, I absolutely love that.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Joseph Stark:Because that is the proof.
Joseph Stark:That's the evidence that when you bring together a plan and you put everything together for the student and it's curated for them, that no matter where they were beginning, they're going to find that success.
Joseph Stark:And a part of that is also experiencing that learning hands on.
Joseph Stark:And at Leadways, we go on these weekly trips to get students into the community to solve real world problems.
Joseph Stark:How did you come up with the idea and make that a staple of our program?
Jun Liu:I think it's a still comeback to when I'm working with high school students.
Jun Liu:And I realized that many of the high school students, when it's come to volunteer, when it's come to doing a small project or doing community service, they don't know what to do.
Jun Liu:For example, last year we actually took some of the students to Taiwan to train those, like younger kids English.
Jun Liu:They're English speaker.
Jun Liu:They teach those kids English.
Jun Liu:Is five kids in the group.
Jun Liu:They're supposed to, you know, just coach their homework.
Jun Liu:You know, I realize some of them, they are not even able to spell the words that the kids ask them.
Jun Liu:It is so funny because the kids got shocked themselves.
Jun Liu:They ask simple words and then they Couldn't even spell themselves.
Jun Liu:They have to use the phone to check how to spell the words.
Jun Liu:However, some of the words you know, they don't know.
Jun Liu:And the kids who learn foreign language, they actually know.
Jun Liu:So that means like those elementary kids, they have larger vocabulary than those high school students.
Jun Liu:Right?
Jun Liu:Some of them.
Jun Liu:So it's just such a wake up call.
Jun Liu:And I realize that many of the high school, they don't know because they don't have the chance to expose themselves to real life, including observing problems.
Jun Liu:I mean, solving problems.
Jun Liu:That is one of the things I feel like, oh, we really have to get them to do the real life.
Jun Liu:Right?
Jun Liu:Because every single day is not about academic.
Jun Liu:It's about learning through the real life and observe what's going on, what do you want to improve and then later on we can find a solution.
Jun Liu:That is also something I shared when I was having another interview and I said everybody was emphasizing the problem solving skill, but actually we want to emphasize the observation of the problem, which is like problem finding skill.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:For example, we want to really contribute to the community.
Jun Liu:And most of the high school, they just ask me, what should I do?
Jun Liu:What can I do?
Jun Liu:You can't experience.
Jun Liu:Last time we bring people, we bring the kids to our events, right?
Jun Liu:They're just standing there.
Jun Liu:Basic, basic volunteer information.
Jun Liu:You have to give a very clear structure because they couldn't find a problem, just try to solve it.
Jun Liu:So I would say problem finding skill is more important at this stage than the problem solving skill.
Jun Liu:I mean, of course we have to train both.
Jun Liu:That's why I feel like if the kids has a chance to really expose to the real world, they have a better chance to figure out what is around them, what's going on.
Jun Liu:It's very different than the parents bring them out.
Joseph Stark:I think you hit that like you just nailed that on the head.
Joseph Stark:So I was actually just reading this book called the Innovator's DNA by Jeff Dyer.
Joseph Stark:And one of the innovator skills is called the observer.
Joseph Stark:And he talks about in the book how true innovators are great observers into be able to move through life and carefully observe everything around you gives you the ability to then actually solve problems.
Joseph Stark:So you do need to be able to identify first and then solve later.
Joseph Stark:And you know, to notice that in your students is amazing.
Joseph Stark:And you know, giving them the opportunity then to go out into the real world and notice those things on their own is truly going to make an impact on their learning.
Joseph Stark:You know, because what we're looking for is authenticity.
Joseph Stark:Right?
Joseph Stark:We're looking for that real.
Jun Liu:Exactly.
Jun Liu:I just feel like the real experience is much better than many of the places.
Jun Liu:They actually create the fake environment.
Jun Liu:Not like fake.
Jun Liu:It's relatively safe for them to, you know, find a problem, solve the problem.
Jun Liu:It's kind of like you're putting them in a paradise and I try to throw them some problems.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:That you designed.
Jun Liu:Is actually not naturally coming from the real world.
Jun Liu:Very interesting thing is like I met one students before who is doing speech and debate.
Jun Liu:Is supposed to be very good at public speaking.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:But no.
Jun Liu:So when I ask questions and he's not able to really, you know, talk freely about what he think about it, you know, what he thought opinion.
Jun Liu:Instead he's like, oh, do you want me to, you know, really tell you something that I learned in my class?
Jun Liu:I'm like, go ahead.
Jun Liu:So he start giving a perfect speech.
Jun Liu:That's what I'm talking about.
Jun Liu:You need that skill set to really be able to stand on the stage.
Jun Liu:Like literally students, right.
Jun Liu:They went on the stage, they tell them why you have to vote for lying, why you have to vote for, you know, what is the other one.
Jun Liu:Pegasus.
Jun Liu:Right?
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Jun Liu:And then they have their reasoning, they, they are there to talking about.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:So it's very different.
Jun Liu:So I feel like maybe we need to rethink about the way we train the kids.
Jun Liu:It's not about all the different classes together.
Jun Liu:They're able to have all the, you know, they equipped it by the skill set.
Jun Liu:So that's also many of the parents, they misunderstood that part.
Jun Liu:They think if I sign up the math class and after school class, you know, debate, speech class, and then they will be fine.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:But they didn't realize the social awareness, communication skill, there's still lack of that.
Joseph Stark:Yeah.
Joseph Stark:And those are really the important skills.
Joseph Stark:You, you know, recently I started calling those the, you know, the human skills.
Jun Liu:Exactly.
Joseph Stark:Because I think when it comes down to it, when we are thinking about students and how they're going to progress in the future, being able to communicate effectively, have empathy, you know, observe the world through a kind eye is, is really going to be important.
Joseph Stark:I mean.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Joseph Stark:And those are, those are things that you can only get from having real world experiences.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Joseph Stark:Going out, making mistakes, having social interactions with good guidance is really going to prepare those kids for the future.
Joseph Stark:You know, and when we're talking about, you know, real world experiences, we're providing this to all of our students at leadways.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Joseph Stark:Every student's had an opportunity to stand up in front of a crowd and greet people they didn't know and deliver material.
Joseph Stark:And some of them figured out really quickly how their body biologically responds.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Joseph Stark:Their palms are sweaty, their knees weak, their arms are heavy and they, they had to learn how to deal with that.
Joseph Stark:And then through that we learned mindfulness and deep breathing and you know, how to calm our nerves.
Joseph Stark:And when they all came back and they all wanted to come back, they asked for a second opportunity.
Joseph Stark:They all performed better and then better and then that's what they're learning.
Joseph Stark:And in the end, these are the skills they're really going to need for AI.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Jun Liu:I predict the future there will be two kind of students.
Jun Liu:One kind is like they know what they do.
Jun Liu:They know how to use AI to really equip them.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:And they have the judgment and they have the integrity.
Jun Liu:They have the self motivation to know what they want.
Jun Liu:And the other group of students who are being manipulated by AI, they can provide a shortcut, they can provide answer directly.
Jun Liu:They help them cheat because cheating becomes so easily never.
Jun Liu:Right?
Jun Liu:That's kind of like the gap.
Jun Liu:I think the gap going to become a bigger.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Jun Liu:So I think the impact is huge.
Jun Liu:At the same time I feel like it's also a challenge for teachers as well.
Jun Liu:So teachers supposed to be the group of people are most knowledgeable, right.
Jun Liu:Knows the most.
Jun Liu:And however with AI, the students can actually challenge teacher.
Jun Liu:They can actually self study.
Jun Liu:So if they can find the self motivation, they have the right guidance, they can progress even faster.
Jun Liu:So I would say one of the biggest impact is about level grade.
Jun Liu:So every school still follow the common core, which we dumped it, right.
Jun Liu:So we don't really follow the common core is because we don't want to really just like hey, kindergarten, first grade, second grade, right.
Jun Liu:Like for example, our students, right?
Jun Liu:You shared with me.
Jun Liu:And we have a second grade learning math level, sixth grade.
Jun Liu:But their English level may be fourth grade.
Jun Liu:But their social emotional level is like second grade or even first grade.
Jun Liu:And those unbalanced situation is not only on one student, is on every single students for some some way, right.
Jun Liu:Sort of different level.
Jun Liu:So I feel like if we are putting AI in it, it can beneficial for personalized learning.
Jun Liu:Which means you can really progress at your own pace.
Jun Liu:But at the same time, how can we teach them to use them correctly?
Jun Liu:How can we still make sure the kids are still be able to think?
Jun Liu:Not in getting the facts or knowledge the answer, but to be able to think.
Jun Liu:So I feel like teaching them how to think has become extremely challenging.
Jun Liu:How can you make sure.
Jun Liu:They have the thinking progress.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:So that's the challenging part.
Jun Liu:And also we have to really get ready because it's not like a coming.
Jun Liu:It's happening right now.
Joseph Stark:Yeah, I mean, currently.
Jun Liu:Yes.
Joseph Stark:As we're speaking, they're releasing agents that are doing all of the tasks now that some people are doing for their regular jobs.
Joseph Stark:And so, you know, when I think of AI and I think of the future of students, you know, it goes back to those human skills.
Joseph Stark:Because when you remove general intelligence from the equation for our students in the future, because they just have so much access to it, what's going to be important is how they treat others.
Jun Liu:Yes.
Joseph Stark:And then it's really our job as educators to be at the forefront of this movement and to best prepare them for the world that they're going to be living in.
Joseph Stark:And so we need to authentically teach them those skills through those real world experiences, but also through guided, curated, you know, social, emotional curriculum.
Joseph Stark:Yes, because the writing's on the wall, June.
Joseph Stark:The traditional way of learning is dead.
Joseph Stark:And there's going to be a lot of educators that are very, very resistant to AI and the quick change that we're having, they're going to be resistant just as people were resistant to calculators back in the past.
Joseph Stark:And when we look back at that, we just think how goofy those people actually were because the calculator has become such a powerful tool that's allowed access to so many people, to advanced math that they never had the opportunity to do before.
Joseph Stark:And that long form, tedious way of learning is now gone.
Joseph Stark:And we use calculators for everything.
Jun Liu:Yes, I agree.
Jun Liu:I totally agree.
Jun Liu:And I also think the education has to be fundamentally changed.
Jun Liu:Not like just a little bit, not adding on a little bit.
Jun Liu:It's fundamentally changed because if you look at education, why we educate kids because we want to educate them to have the skill to be able to work in an industry that is after the Industrial revolution and basically all the schools are prepared, the kids, to be the better worker in the future.
Jun Liu:But then now the things changed.
Jun Liu:So if the parents cannot change the mindset to realize that they cannot using the same way to teach the kids for the new kind of world, they will be out of date.
Joseph Stark:Yeah, yeah.
Joseph Stark:I mean, it's important to adapt.
Joseph Stark:And I think you're right.
Joseph Stark:And I think we're, we're onto something with what we're doing here, right?
Jun Liu:Yes.
Joseph Stark:And it's, it's that personalized learning and adapting the lessons.
Joseph Stark:You know, I think where a lot of other Schools get wrong is that to innovate, they simply just add another class.
Jun Liu:Yes.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Joseph Stark:And that.
Joseph Stark:But that's not, that's not true innovation because in the end, you're not actually changing learning, you're not changing the environment.
Joseph Stark:You're just giving them the same information in the same style as you did all of the other classes.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Jun Liu:You just change a different box and you put them into the box.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:It's just like cookie cutting stuff.
Joseph Stark:Yeah, no, it is.
Joseph Stark:Well, we're, you know, we're in an exciting time right now with education.
Jun Liu:We're definitely the pioneer.
Jun Liu:We are leading the ways.
Jun Liu:That's why we call leadaways.
Joseph Stark:We really are.
Joseph Stark:And I think that a big part of that is not being afraid to break from what's normal.
Jun Liu:Yes.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Joseph Stark:When I agree, when I was joining here and we were talking about, you know, what does it look like to personalize education?
Joseph Stark:And then you start unshackling these students from their age groups and grade levels and truly meet them where they are.
Joseph Stark:It was difficult for me to conceptualize, but as I got more comfortable with it, it just made so much more sense to teach kids at their rate.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Joseph Stark:We don't learn in a straight line.
Joseph Stark:We have our ups and downs.
Joseph Stark:It looks more like a mountain.
Joseph Stark:And kids need support in different areas at different times, and it's not linear.
Joseph Stark:So, you know, trying to explain that to parents, though, has been so difficult.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Joseph Stark:Because it's.
Joseph Stark:It's so different from what they're used to.
Joseph Stark:Right?
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Joseph Stark:Even when they.
Joseph Stark:And they come in and they're like, so my kid's gonna be in kindergarten.
Joseph Stark:Right.
Joseph Stark:And I'm like, well, not really.
Jun Liu:And very interesting is when I tell them we are actually mixing all the grades together, many parents are like, oh, are you doing the Montessori way?
Jun Liu:I'm like, you don't even know what is Montessori is.
Jun Liu:And that's not a Montessori way.
Jun Liu:I feel like the benefit for mixing age together is benefit for younger kids.
Jun Liu:They can become a more mature.
Jun Liu:They know how to associate and socialize with all the, you know, know, the bigger kids.
Jun Liu:And many parents say, like, oh, yeah, I want my kids to hang out with the older kids.
Jun Liu:But what about the older kids and the older kids?
Jun Liu:Parents, they say, I want my kids to hang out with older kids.
Jun Liu:I don't want to hang out with young kids.
Jun Liu:But I say it's beneficial for both the older kids.
Jun Liu:Hung out with young kids can take care of them.
Jun Liu:Getting more responsibility can actually give them a More empathy about the world.
Jun Liu:And at the same time, we are putting a lot of, like, a chances for them to talk to adults.
Jun Liu:So basically, the bigger kids hang out with adult and younger kids to adjust their status in that environment.
Joseph Stark:They're also the best teachers for the younger kids.
Jun Liu:Exactly.
Joseph Stark:Because the younger kids look up to them more so than they do the teachers.
Joseph Stark:They listen to them a lot better as well.
Joseph Stark:But also I think that, you know, when we have a sixth grader who's, you know, working with a first or a second grader, they remember what it was like to be.
Joseph Stark:Be that way.
Joseph Stark:And so they can really truly empathize with them because they understand the struggle or why they didn't want to do something or, you know, how scared they were on the first day of school.
Joseph Stark:And so when we partner them up for these activities, there's like, a really good connection there.
Joseph Stark:And even the kids from our shadow days, when they go home, they're like, ranting and raving about the older students that they hung out with.
Joseph Stark:And then our older students are so excited when they come back.
Jun Liu:Yes.
Joseph Stark:They're like, oh, my God, that's so.
Joseph Stark:And so.
Joseph Stark:I can't.
Joseph Stark:You know, we.
Joseph Stark:We were playing in this and this and this and this, and they're.
Joseph Stark:They're like, super excited to see each other.
Joseph Stark:And that's a really unique experience that the kids get here.
Jun Liu:Yes.
Jun Liu:And because we're using the real experience, let them to hang out.
Joseph Stark:Yeah.
Jun Liu:We're not creating a fake environment to let them.
Jun Liu:To improve their social awareness.
Jun Liu:Right.
Jun Liu:So I really see that value on the kids and I see how they care about the people around them, no matter elderly, younger.
Jun Liu:It's amazing to see that.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Joseph Stark:Well, that's all I've got for you today, June, if you have anything else you want to add.
Jun Liu:Oh, I have too much.
Jun Liu:I can't even stop.
Jun Liu:You're going to spend a whole day with me.
Jun Liu:I have to continue talking a lot.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Joseph Stark:So we'll.
Joseph Stark:We'll come back another time then.
Jun Liu:Okay, sure.
Joseph Stark:But this was great.
Joseph Stark:Thank you for joining for our inaugural episode of the Learning Frontier.
Jun Liu:I think everybody would like to enjoy having conversation with you sitting like this.
Jun Liu:They must have come here to check it out.
Jun Liu:It's so cool.
Jun Liu:Yeah.
Joseph Stark:Well, that's it.
Joseph Stark:That's our episode with Jun Liu, founder and pioneer of Leadway School.
Joseph Stark:And for anyone listening right now, feel free to follow us and subscribe.
Joseph Stark:Welcome to the.
